"You're In Charge" with Glenn Pasch
"You're In Charge" with Glenn Pasch

Episode 101 · 6 months ago

Inspired Leadership While Climbing the Right Mountain with Tony Martignetti


What if your leadership style is hurting you? What if what you thought was leadership actually in holding you back. That is the conversation in this episode with Tony Martignetti, leadership coach and author of the book "Climbing the Right Mountain. Tony shares his journey where he pivoted from a secure job but not a great work environment to start his own company helping leaders understand what inspired leadership means and how it delivers better results. 

 He also share how his journey inspired his book based on the idea of getting to the top of your desired mountain only to find out you chose the wrong path. A very thoughtful and inspiring conversation. 

Enjoy it Don't forget to subscribe, share and rate the show.   

About Tony Martignetti He is an executive leadership coach, creator of Inspired Purpose Coaching, and host of The Virtual Campfire Podcast. And author of the book Climbing the Right Mountain. Tony was a finance and strategy professional working in some of the world’s leading life sciences and biotech companies before pivoting into coaching. He was unhappy in the toxic workplace environments he was in and made it his mission to help business leaders succeed in pivoting their careers. Tony has extensive experience building high-performing teams, avoiding stress and burnout, and helping leaders live fulfilling lives by coaching them and their teams to navigate through change by unlocking their true potential.  

Connect with Tony  


Order his book: https://amzn.to/2Zmtlh3  

About Glenn Pasch:   

"Everyone finds themselves in charge at some point in their lives. Yet many of us lack the skills to generate consistent results. My goal is to help you learn the skills to adapt and grow in your personal and business life.”  

Glenn Pasch is CEO of PCG Digital, a full service digital marketing agency that specializes in helping businesses create and deliver customers raving, recommending & returning for more. 

He is author of 2 books including "The Power of Connected Marketing" and has spoken and educated audiences throughout the US and internationally.    

 Let’s Connect:   

Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/glennpasch/​ 

Personal Website http://glennpasch.com/​ 

Company website: https://pcgdigital.com/

Support for this episode comes from PCG digital. It is anywhere from difficult to impossible to manage every aspect of the changing digital landscape. Rather than trying to do it yourself, why not leave it to an award winning team of Digital Marketing Specialists who have mastered at all? Connect to your message with more potential customers with PCG digital. Go to PCG digitalcom for more information. Hi and welcome to another episode of you're in charge. Conversations that sparked change. I'm your host, Glen Pash and in today's episode we talk with Leadership Coach and author Tony Martin Ettie about his journey and how he had to pivot his whole life, and that became the inspiration of his book climbing the Right Mountain, and he challenges me, and now he'll challenge you as well, to think about that. Are you really fulfilled, are you working towards something that you really are meant to do, or are you climbing that wrong mountain? And that's led him now to build his own leadership company, focusing and helping all of us to be more inspired leaders ourselves, but also through how we coach and develop our teams. We are inspiring them as well. So I'm really excited for this conversation. Can't wait to share it with you. So let's dive into day's episode of You'R in charge conversations, a spark change with author and leadership coach Tony Martin Eddie. All right, so, Tony, thank you so much for being here. Really excited to unpack a lot of things. I was excited to really dive into who you are and what you do. Love to talk about your book, and we'll get that in a moment because it was just release. But this concept of inspired leadership, that really struck a note with me. You see a lot of people talking about leadership, different monikers around leadership, but the fact of being inspired leadership. UNPACK that for me. What does that mean? Yeah, I'm so glad to be here. First of all just to say that I'm thank you for treating the space and I would just say that, you know, the starting point of being inspired leadership is starting with having this ability to see yourself as being someone who's inspired yourself. Before you can lead others down this math of being inspired, you have to start with what is it that we're all about? How are we creating something that's bigger than just one person or a group of people coming together and, you know, banging out our jobs and doing things together. It has to be something bigger. What is the bigger purpose behind what we're doing? And that inspiration piece is that it's not something that just shows up once and then you like great, now we're done. It has to be built over time. It's an ongoing effort where we see ourselves, as you know, what is keeping the engine going, how we continue to build the muscle that's inspiring us on a daily basis on this quest to create what we want as a company, as an organization, as a group of people who want to change something in the world. So what if it's like so that that's interesting, because what I got out of that, just right out of the gate, is there's an intentionality about it, meaning there is a you know, we are going to build something where we have a vision of where we want to go. So it sounds is if, and correct me if I'm wrong, it's we have an angld. We need to sort of reverse engineer back to actions that are going to inspires. So it's a almost cyclical if I'm inspired to be a part of this. The fact that we are getting results inspires me. So it becomes this you know, circle engine, and I am I am I on the right path with that. Yeah, there's you're absolutely right. Mean, you just just you just hit the nail on the head in the sense that you don't just show up one day and say I'm inspired to do this activity. But what happens is you get people to follow along because they're excited about the vision that you've created or you've collectively created a vision that excites them. Get some thinking that this is a worthy cause, it's something that we're excited about doing. Like, I came from the world of biotech where, you know, the big purpose, especially for the leaders that I worked on, worked with. Originally, there was this element of putting the patient at the center of everything. Right, and when you do that there's just elements of like there's somebody's life on the line, and when we do that, this element of you can't wait,...

...you have to continue to push on and seeing how can we help that person. That person's face shows up on your doorstep every day and you say, yeah, I can't wait to go to the office and see what I can do every day to help that person, that child, live a better life. And then as you get results and you see, wow, this is working. You know now if we do this more thing or we innovate here, we create this and we're starting to move this engine forward. Then you have a setback and you see a setback as what can we do with this? When create with the setback right and a leader who doesn't connect with truly what inspires them will fail. They'll just say, oh, it is what it is. I mean maybe this is not the right path for us. So show without that inspiration, you're not willing to fight through the tough times. Exactly exactly. HMM. Okay, let me let me ask something about that. Because again, when you're talking about in Biotecher, talking about an individual. In this case your example was someone who is a patient, someone sick, it is that experience. Does it apply to companies that are building products, because should they be looking past the product to the experience that the customer is going to have interacting with this product? I think sometimes we stop at the product. What are your thoughts on that? Yeah, I love that you brought this in because I I've always thought about experience as being in such an important part of the overall thing that we're creating as leaders. It's not just about, oh, great, look, what I've created is amazing. You know, iphone or with not to pick on apple, but it's so much more than that. Right now, you've created something that allows people to communicate, to to do something. And what is it that? There's a jobs to be done. It's the experience overall, like how do you create a community with your product? So I think that is exactly what we need to tap into. Is that? What is the bigger picture that you're trying to treat with your company? Because if you're just trying to create a better product, I think you're missing something right, I agree with you. So the so then let's break this down. So someone, you know, the point of this podcast is always been to help the people who, as you were saying, we're in that leadership position or we want to be in the leadership or work overseeing a product or project. And here are, here they are, and they're sitting there going okay, Tony, it's all sounds good, right, I want to be inspired. I'm inspired, but how do I get my team? So walk me through maybe one or two things. That's someone could do, because when you say inspiring someone, it takes actions or communication, as you said. So walk me through something that an individual listening to this could take away to say, let me go try this with my team to see if I can ignite a little bit of that inspiration. Yeah, so the first step is to be truly honest with themselves, to step away from the day to day grind of what they're doing and say themselves, am I truly doing this for the right reasons? What's my reason for doing the want the work I'm doing? You may think you're inspired, but make sure you're connected to the reason why you're doing this, is connected to a story that is deeper than just making money or making a better widget or, you know, whatever it may be, and make sure you have that in a way that it connects to your deeper sense of who you are, because when it does, what happens is, without you even saying a word, you're speaking volumes. People will get to feel you and understand that you do truly understand and value the work that you're doing. If you're trying to fake it, people see right through that, right. But if you're so so again, I can I can hear people in their head going that this sounds a little touchy feeling. Yes, right, it's a little touchy feely. But if someone was saying, listen, I'm doing this because I'm I want to provide for my family, right, so I'm working hard, I want to do a good job for my you know, for my business. But, for instance, off on a salesperson are is what I'm hearing you say is go beyond. I sold ten. But if you understand what the impact for those consumers by having this widget, whatever it is, we'll bring more, maybe excitement, more passion, more inspiration to you, because it if it's just the number versus what this sale does on the other side to help someone. Right, then with then we get you stuck into numbers...

...and and it, we can end up losing touch with why we're even here. And then there's the frustrations and, as we said, not willingness to learn more, to push through to be more successful. Exactly. It's you reminding me of a quote that I don't know where this key from originally, but it's this elements of like if you focus on money, you'll make money, if you focus on impact, you'll have an impact. Right, you have to decide what you want as a leader, you know, when you go with right intention, of what it is that you want to create, whether you're a sales leader or you're a leader at the you know, the CEO, CFO. What you have to do is you get to be very intentional and transparent about what you want to create, because the people around you are watching and listening and they're going to pick up on those things, whether you're saying them or embodying them. Right, and I know that again, this is all very touchy Feeley, but the reality is this is happening, but it's not. It's not really I did. But See, this is the thing now, the way that you're explaining it, it's not necessarily touchy Feeley. Right. So if you're saying I'm a leader, I'm creating an environment for my team. Yeah, right, so that when someone comes into my environment on my team, we are we have a purpose that we're going to work where, we have training or tasks or skills that we're constantly may improving to deliver that. But at the same moment in time we are creating an environment to support each other, help each other to achieve this greater goal. So so what you're saying is is that it's not touchy feeling. Inspiration is the by product of action. That's what it sounds like. So it sounds like what you're saying is is be thoughtful of how you're setting up and what you're doing with your team and creating that environment so that people can and thrive and and feel like they are doing something bigger than the just checking the box. I did my job, time to go home. Yeah, absolutely, and it's funny you say that about inspirations the byproduct of action. It's right and wrong, because you have it's actually the it's like the chicken and egg inspiration to move into the right actions, but you also once you take those actions, it inspires you to do more. Right, it is a byproduct, but it's also a precursor or you be able to step into the right actions. Right. Yeah, I think so. That's right. That makes sense, because, you know, I could be inspired, but if I don't know what to do, then then I lose my inspiration. On the flip side, if I'm if I have the right actions and I step into it would but I think that I think it'd. Yeah, I think that inspiration is that willingness to go into something that maybe I'm not comfortable with you at or I have an idea in my head and I have to do it and then once I step into this, all of a sudden I'm getting that feedback and I think that's one of the things I want to dive in a little deeper into, because you touched on it, but I don't want people to skim by it. was that idea of taking a moment to be self aware of how you process the feedback as you're moving through all of this, to hopefully right put you if you're on the wrong path or the wrong actions and you're not feeling how do I get back on on track, to keep that willingness to come show up again tomorrow and give it another shot? Yes, absolutely, I love you say this because there's something something about that. That is a journey that we're all on. You know, there's you know you don't always have this element of like immediate feedback that says great, you know, I did this action and I got results and right, you know, repeat, right. It doesn't work that way. Life doesn't work that way. You sometimes have to commit to a longer gain and continuing to do the actions and expect that that's planting a seed for a period of time that eventually will bear fruit. So then, how is a leader right? Because, and I agree with you on that, there are some things that are very transactional. In the moment you know if it works or it doesn't work, or you get maybe it doesn't work or doesn't work on the grander scale, but you're getting feedback where other times you may not see it. But, as you said, planting the seed. So how does what would you advise a leader who sat in front of you and said, okay, yes, our process is longer term, meaning we're not going to see the results for sixty, ninety days, six months, maybe a year, real results that we can make a judgment on? How do you keep keep that team moving forward when maybe the actions or the job is, I don't want to say monotonous, it's a row own were, but it could be a little bit of groundhogs day, let's say, where it's it's very similar every day. So so what's the re recommendations for inspiration? How do why is...

...a leader stay inspired to to cheer these people on, or they just looking at me and saying, well, a client's doing his job with you know, he's doing it all out. Well, then we'll do our job all out. How do you help them keep their team on track? I'm going to throw a few math formula for you. So sure, I love that. Let's go. So I'm a former finance person, so I, you know, used to spend my life in numbers and equations. And the formula is that you have to take some risk, some measured risk, plus some courage and some intuition. And intuition me defind all those terms a little bit. Intuition comes from experience, it comes from this ability to have had some results in the past and things that you've tried before in your prior lize as a you know, in your journey to becoming the leader that you are, knowing that sometimes these things work out, sometimes they don't, and now you're at this place where you're put in the place to make a decision. Courage, the courage to really say I'm willing to go forth into the unknown, I'm willing to take this chance and know that if it doesn't work out, you know what can I do with them? And then measured risk is to know that you're not going to put the entire company at risk of failure by taking this course of action. So all those things, those things come together there to to allow you to take that next step into the into what the next path would be, because you're not going to know the results of those things. You right by doing those things and allowing your team to see that you're doing this without knowing the answers. HMM, and you're sharing that with them transparently. It helps them to come along with confidence. So my brain, as you were talking, just went right to the next sort of topic and pivot, and so my point is then, for my question is where do you see the obstacles? Right, so we're I we got our math formula and this all makes sense on paper, but a company brings you in to say, Hey, I need some help, Tony. Yeah, where the obstacles were? Where are the struggles? Is there a commonality that you've seen in all of your work with different organizations that you know when you walk in and you do maybe you're audit to say, okay, what's going on? Are there? Are there maybe a few common obstacles that all struggling organizations have? Yeah, one of the biggest obstacles is this, this desire to stay to their path that they've been on and not wanting to change. People say that they're willing to change or they're willing to try new, innovative approaches, but often times so afraid of stepping out into a bold, unknown right and I think that is the irony at all. A lot of that talk of change is it sounds good on paper, but actually committing to that is the hardest part for anybody. Well, do you find when you sit in those conversations with with you know, let's say the leadership table, because I've been in the same situation. You know, if I've been brought in, that's the first question I asked is, do you really want to change? You know because this you is going to be there are going to be some struggles. Do you find it's a divided table, meaning that maybe one person definitely wants to go in on the change, they understand why and they understand the struggles, and maybe other people go I don't want to really deal with the pushback from our team or I don't want to have to deal with all of that. You know it. Is it more divided or is it usually unified in the yeah, we want to change, but now we really don't want to. There's a lot of division. I mean there's in it, and I wouldn't paint every situation is the same, but right are a lot of companies that are you know this, not everyone's on the same page because there's a lot of the functions that are operating from this place of like I I know what's right for my function, I know what is right from my point of view, but I haven't quite embraced the view of what the what's right for the overall company to move the company forward. And I often think about the the old adage of like the Big Arrow in the little arrows and trying to get everyone working in the same direction. And that's really what a lot of the work that I do is about, is helping people to get alignment around what is it that were really after and how do does me getting...

...aligned with the big Arrow really help to drive the mission forward? And that might really be a kink into my own ego to say that I was wrong or that my position is not the right path, and when you do get people to own up to that and see that the change is good, it's really a powerful way to move forward. Do you find as an advisor going in that sometimes the need or the desire for change is is based on the fact that they may not be doing what they're supposed to be doing a hundred percent, meaning that they think they have to change more than they have to. But if they actually were doing what they told you they were supposed you know, if you said, well, what, what should your team be doing and they said, well, they should be doing these ten things, and you go look and you're going, they're doing six of them, but if we got them to do all ten of them, maybe only have to change one or two things. Do you find that that is also a contributing factor, that somewhere along the line, accountability has been causing this this angst in terms of change? You said the a word accountability. It's important that we hold people accountable to saying you know, hey, this is what we agree to, this we need to do and if you're willing to take those steps, this is what's going to create this movement forward. Now you can't expect people to have perfect actions perfect path forward. There is going to be setbacks, is going to be things that are in the way, but we also have to have good communication that allows us to say this is why I'm not making progress on this, this is why I'm having challenges, and address those issues as you go forward. So there's an element of like balancing that accountability and call it action, because you have to knowledge without action is meaningless. Yeah, you can present a plan that says this is what we need to do to move forward, but if no one takes any action, it's like, okay, well, that's not going to help. Right. But if you put a plan in place, hold people accountable, but then have compassion along the way to say like yeah, I mean, okay, these things cannot be perfect. Let's learn, you forward just and then continue to go on this path. Right, I love, I. Well, I love what you just said. They're because I'm a firm believer of that as well. In terms of changes, hard we have to be, as a leader, empathetic to the learning curve. Right there. There a lot of it is how you train in the beginning or how you communicate what the change is going to be, your willingness to invest in them in the beginning to help them along the way. And there are going to be people who want to go back to their old habits and you have to be willing. I mean there has, there are eventually will be a point where you say it's time to come on board. But to your point is, and I think it's real for all of you listening, we're leading teams with Tony just said, is truly important is having the being the guide, but being that coach, having the empathy to help people through this. So let's pivot a little bit. How, you know, I was looking at your sort of your history and where you came from. Love to know a little bit about how why you ended up where you are now. Where did this passion for helping leaders? You know, we'll get to the book in a moment, but the fact that here you are coaching and developing and helping people do this as this always been in your DNA. You know, if we roll back to ninth grade, Tony, that you've always been someone who has been sort of a coach and developing, no matter where you were. HMM, it's an interesting question. I love this question because my journey to getting to where I am has been quite interesting. I was an artist as a child and my artistry was more around creating, looking at the experience that people have. I would paint rooms and emotional experiences of rooms. People would walk into rooms and have different ways of showing up and in experiencing them, and it was something that I thought I would do forever. In fact, I was going to be an architect. That was my plan, and eventually I ended up becoming a premed major and then switching in a business. Eventually, and then along the way, I realize it's had this ability to see people, but I continue to buckle down and be a finance person right with numbers. It was almost like I was forcing myself into this world of numbers. But the reality is that along this way I came to see that there were leaders. I was a student of leadership all along. I was always watching what leaders did, how they showed up, how they connected with people, and it all...

...kind of came to a head when I had this moment in a board room where I had, you know, I've been on this journey of Understanding Coaching and, you know, seeing burnout and all these things has happened to me, and this moment was just seeing two leaders argue about something meaningless and right. It was about them protecting their own image around. You know, forty people sitting in this room and just realizing that, my Gosh, this is not leadership, this is this is toxic and vital reality, and I had this feeling in me that said I can't do this any longer, I can't connect, I can't collect a paycheck any longer and allow this to be my life right of just, you know, sitting in board rooms and allowing people to just do this. I need to do something different. And so I walked out, m walked out and I said, I'm going to change the room. I'm going to leave the room to change the room. That's what I did. Oh, I love that. Leave the lead, the relieve the room to change the room. Yeah, and and it's not to say that that's the path for everybody, because, honestly, God, it's it's really can be quite a daunting to go out. Entrepreneurial Path is not for everybody, but it was for me. It's what I had to do. I had to go out and endeavor and this into this journey and that's what led me into into what I'm doing and honestly, I'm so grateful because it's created this this journey for me to dig deeper into who I am and to see how the inner journey can unlock so much for people as a you know, not just leaders, but I think you know anyone who wants to go in that journey of seeing who they deeply are. It starts with having deep conversations with yourself and seeing what I stand for right whom I really well what I liked about that. And I think again, you know, in these conversations that I have with with my guests, and especially right here, is a lot of times the most successful, and again not monetarily but grounded successful, people who are they feel very rooted in what they're doing at the moment, are those that take their whole journey, everything they've done, as valuable, versus discounting something because maybe it wasn't successful or I didn't like doing that. I had a conversation with someone yesterday and we were talking about in his journey and he said, if I only knew this next you know back then, what could I have done? And I said, but here's a thing, if you knew what you know now back then, you wouldn't be here, you wouldn't be the person you are today. We'd like to always look back two thousand and twenty and hindsight and said if only I invested in this, boy, would I be better? I'd say, but you wouldn't be here, you wouldn't have you, the family that you have, your friends that you have. Who knows, you're painting the picture as it's all going to be beautiful. But I had said to another from one time who made the comment if I only invested, I would be rich, and I said yeah, but how do you know you would have been a good person? How do you know you wouldn't have overdosed? How do you know you'd still be alive? I mean there's so many variables versus saying everything I am has brought me to today and I I love what You keep you've you've said it multiple times. is where are we going with this? What, what impact are we going to have today and tomorrow based on everything we have? So give me one or two things in your journey that really stood out as an impactful moment for you. That said, I look back, even if it was something that you said. Man, I felt flat on my face, but I'm so grateful I did because I think a lot of people look at you touched on it before this. Setbacks, we newgate setbacks as sometimes negative versus look what you learned. Oh, absolutely, yeah, and it's funny. I'll just say, like you say, like two thousand and twenty vision, and you know, I think two thousand and twenty is taken on a new new meaning now. Yeah, well, skip twio. Okay, very welcome. Well, I would say the first thing that I would connect with is the first time that I was laid off from a job. I think is always it's always a moment that people have and they say like, oh my Gosh, when you attach all of your meaning to a job, it it feels like being punched in the Gut. HMM. What I've really come to see, and it's something that I see in a lot of people,...

...is that we have to stop connecting all of our all of our worth into one thing. That's what I did for a lot of my career. I started to connect with this feeling of like putting all my eggs into one basket. HMM, and De Funny Myself as I am the finance guy, and now I know that's far from the truth and when you liberate yourself from that, it is just the most amazing feeling and knowing that you can create just about anything if you're committed, if you're committed to the work, and not just the work, but if you're committed to feeling all the feelings that go along with the journey of going into the unknown. Right. See, I love that, because so there's two parts and people who have were less their nurse to the this podcast. Have heard me mention this a few times. Is One of my volunteer sort of side gigs is helping people in job transition and I would speak to them and a lot of them were in their S S, s, S S and they had been in an Organization for eight, ten years and they were laid off or whatever and now they're going. What do I do? And I communicate because I was the exact same way. I'd work for an Organization for about twelve, thirteen years and was told, though, you'll never be your valuable and when things got bad I was one of the first people to go, but I had so wrapped my whole being into that job I had no not you know, no one knew me. No, I didn't know what I didn't even know what I was good at. HMM, and it took a long time to unpack that where I vowed I will never be tied. The job is part of me, it's what I do, but it's not me. Yeah, and I really agree with that and I think that's such a great lesson for everyone listening is that your job is not you. And you know, if you strip away all the titles at every company you had, there's a common thread of you through all of that. Forget the title. Who Are you? What have you done? And I love that. What you're saying is is that you. It's everything about it and and it frees you up. Versus, as you said, I'm the finance manager. That's limiting. Versus, look at all that I bring to the people that I'm surrounded with at this moment on my journey. Yeah, what is unique to you about that? You know, and that's, you know, something that is really powerful, and I think most people don't see themselves. They just see the things that they do, the doing and not the being. Well, it's the title. A lot of times it's you know, it's an easy way for everyone to turn around and say how they can communicate with each other of who they are, right and and and it's one of those things, as you said, believe you go to a cocktail party or whatever you meet. Some people like one of the first of all questions is, what do you do? Yeah, because it's easy for everybody to frame. Oh, you're a finance person, frame your this, frame versus really just that's what I do, but that's not who I am and I think that's a big difference which is going circling all the way back to the beginning of this. That's where that inspirational leadership comes from. It's not the title. The the most uninspiring leaders lead with their title and they wield their title like a hammer to beat you into submission to do the work. Versus the title is just it's I always say, the title just means I have different duties than you do to make the machine move forward. That's all it is. It's not it's not a hammer. So I think all of this conversation circling back to inspired and understanding yourself and who you are and freeing yourself to be more present. I think it's really something. I'm so glad we're talking about it because I think it's so necessary and I feel it in people and organizations and maybe because it was, as you joke, two thousand and twenty was so devastating to a lot of people that people now are looking and going their questioning a lot of different things now. Yeah, and I think that's a great thing for them to question. We should continue to question and it's funny you had asked me, like what are some other you know, I want to add another moment short that learning moment, and I'll choose one that is actually more recent. It was pretty two thousand and twenty, but it was something that I really learned along my journey becoming starting my business, and it was when I first started coaching, being the impostor of course, that I think I was like, Oh, who am I to do this? Right, you first start thinking about, you know, competition and thinking about, you know, how do I create my niche and all the stuff, and one of the things I learned early days...

...is this is that, and it's all wrap it up in a quote. Should I love quotes, as you can see, is that, you know, amateurs compete and professionals create. Instead of going out there and feeling like, Oh, I can't share what I'm doing with the people, like other coaches or other consultants or other professionals, I decided to really embrace this idea of learning from the people who have been on the journey already, sure, and figuring out how can I learn from them? How can I be a learner again, a beginner again, because I am a beginner at that point, even though I had a long career, and being open to to being vulnerable to other people. And what it did is it really created this elements of like people seeing me as, you know, someone to collaborate with, HMM, to create something bigger together, to creating communities, being in community, and it really opened up this space of abundance versus scarcity, feeling like, Oh, I have to be the lone soul writer that has to win the day. Well, it's that. It's that idea of zero sum, right, so, if I win, you lose, if you win, I lose. Versus. You know, people have always asked me, maybe you know, for my my marketing agency, when we we would hold events, I would good friends of mine who ran agencies. I said, well, why don't you come participating? People always were dumbfounded. They're saying, why are you bringing another agency? You know they're going to steal the work, and I said there's enough for everybody. Would you stop with this and I think, to your point, for all everyone who's listening, if you're in a leadership position or you're starting new project or you're, you know, going out on your own and you're taking that leap of faith. I hate to say it, but most people they're not focused on you, they're not worried about you. Right, we love to think that everybody is thinking about US versus. No, so go out and ask with humility and confidence. It's not all. Please, if you're saying hey, listen, Tony, I really respect what you're doing. Could could you do this? That's what I did when I started the podcast. A very dear friend of mine. He has a very successful podcast, and I said, all right, can you help me? And he said, are you willing to do it now, because I'd been talking about it for a year, and he said, I'm not talking anymore. When you're ready to do it, call me and I said, okay, I'm ready, and he was more than generous. Now someone would say, well, why would he do that? Because there's enough for everybody and I really love that, that abundance mentality. I think it's really important for everyone to really embrace. So I want to. I would I don't. We're just chatting away in time always runs quickly on these things, but I would be remiss. I your your book climbing the Right Mountain. When we connected, I was like, let me go look at this, and I see that it's a new release, right, fair, fairly new, but I started reading it and I so again, I love the fact that you do have quotes all in there, which I love. But one of the quotes I thought was really great. You know what happens? You know, we all want to, I'm paraphrasing it, you know, climbing to the top of the ladder. That's what we want to do. But what if it's leaning against the wrong mountain? And I thought that was really cool. So tell me about I have specific things to ask you, but first talk to me about the Genesis of where this book came from and and what was it like to really commit to writing this. Yeah, well, it's a great question. So, first and foremost, you know, the Genesis of the book came from this hearing people stories, you know, coaching people along the way and realizing that, my Gosh, like this really felt like I was talking to myself as I was hearing from people and realizing that I was on this path to getting to this place of you know, I'm at the top of my mountain, theoretically, and feeling like I don't like the view. And I spent all this time and effort where I burning myself out, you know, sacrificing time with family, friends and all the people of my life, and even my health for that matter, to create something that I don't think I defined for myself. I think it was defined by society people around me that this is what you should want in life. And so then I said to myself, Oh Gosh, this story is what people would really value. Is here that you can do it differently. You can create a path at any point in your life. You're never too old, you're never too young. Right. It's like the Harry Potter steps. You can move the the stairs a different way and goes back to intentionally.

You know, if you stopped for a moment and say like you did, I may not be to the top of the Mounta, or maybe you work as you say, but I'm getting up pretty high here and I don't like this view. So either I build it to a different mountain or come down off this ladder and go throw my ladder up against another mountain and start that climb exactly exactly, and it's in what you really need to do is start thinking about, like who do you want to be along that journey? Not Right, do I want to have the titles and things like that, and it's not to say, Oh, don't strive to be see, you know, don't strive for this. Gosh, shoot for the Moon, sure, but ultimately do it for the right reasons. Do for the reasons to fulfill you personally and do it for who you want to be at the end of the day, because ultimately that's what matters. What's going to matter is the impact that you want to have. An others no, and I think that's great. A gentleman I just interviewed and it's going to be an episode. He is a dear friend of mine, but his name is Dan more and he just did a Ted talk and it was talking about is your why a lie right? Same thing all, are we really aligned? And hit one of his last things. And then I want to get to the couple things that have about your book. But he always said you get one ticket on this ride and when you're done, do you have regrets or you fulfilled. So to your point is, sometimes we are focused on doing things, maybe for the wrong reasons. We think they're the right but in our heart we're going they're really wrong and we're we've talked ourselves is into it and all of a sudden times done or the rides over and you go, Oh, if I only, if I could have and and that's why I love the title of the book. So so I want to jump into this because, as always reading it, and I'm just you probably about fifteen twenty pages in, and it's and it's a great book. It's a compact read, folks. So I'm recommending this book highly. I'll make sure it's in the show notes here. But you talked about this idea of your excitement for traveling, yes, but how you've moved that towards all experiences in your life. So let me just ask you a couple things. So I got to put them for those of you listening. I got put on my glasses because I'm half half blind. But you say embrace novelty. Right, that's number one. No matter what it is, embrace novelty. Number two is be curious. Number three is check in with yourself along the way right. We're that was what we were talking about before. Getting feedback on what's going on. Don't plan every detail. Love that. I want to hear more about that and then keep a travel journal about the experience. So that makes complete sense. When I'm going on vacation, as you're saying, don't plan everything and keep a travel journal. Give me the I love it. Talk to me about how that parallel one applies to all of your experiences, you know. And then, secondly, what you know? This idea of travel. I guess it means we're traveling on this. So it makes sense too. So, so talk to me of a little about that out of those different steps, because I found it really so as I read it. It just it just was like a bell that went off on my head and I was like, boom, I got to ask Tony about this. Yeah, now I you know, obviously that comes right through this this idea that I love travel. It's not just about sitting on a beach, it's about having adventures that really, you know, Fill your soul with, you know, an understanding of the world and those tips that I've been am offering and you know how they translate into your into your life, and how to create a better path for you. It's novelty is what our brains crave, especially during periods of finding ourselves in the malaise of the patterns of stuck in so the novelty is what will really kind of get us unstuck and trying new things will help to see. Well, maybe this thing that I'm seeing well, you know, get me unstuck and think. You know, I never, I never thought about trying to, you know, blow glass or play the guitar or just going on a hike someplace in there. I've been hiking. You know, that might be something that will lighten me up and create something new and me right where, you know. And then the writing in the journal is something that is so powerful because what happens is it helped, helps you to think about the this is what's happening in my life at this point. But, as we said before, you know you're on a journey that you know, the student has not necessarily met the right teacher yet, and when you do, you're going to want to make sure that you know, when you reflect back on yourself, you say like that's where it was. Now I'm here, right now, I can write follow the bread crumbbs that have been laid out in my journal, my exercising, that you're on that that element of writing,...

...on your your journey, you'll start to see the things that have been the patterns, the trends, the feet threads that are being laid out for you. So is that because I love the the the the curiosity, but that idea of planning details. What struck me about that is I've been guilty of it. I know I know people who I've run across who ask me for advice or I've counseled or coached or whatever, however you want to say. The planning of all the details it create potentially can create a hesitation of taking that first step because that's not all perfectly mapped out. Versus, what you're saying is trust to giving yourself enough details to have a sense of direction, but allow your curiosity, and I think that's why I love this, is that the curiosity will push you through, to say that's going to keep you going because you're what's around the corner. Give yourself check in with feedback and go, am I in the right direction whatever? But that don't let the planning stop you from moving forward. But that that's something I thought was very powerful. Yeah, you're absolutely right, of the money. And he's like you want to make sure that you have some directional sense, but leaving some space for serendipity to show up and allow yourself to, you know, see what this avenue might treat for you, but then, you know, looking for those elements of like what is this all telling me, when direction is is all creating for me? There's a magic in all this that as you continue to let it unfold and checking into saying like, you know, what is this revealing? Right, I really like that and I think you know, as I said, I just a few pages in, but it's just it's hooked me because of that. It seems very your writing style is very accessible. It's not talking down at you or preaching to say hey, you're on the wrong amount, go over here. But what I love it's that balance of and I think those five steps really encapsulate the book and and and part of our conversation today. It seems that we, we always must remind ourselves that new is not bad. It's understanding and taking time to be curious, to ask so that we can make a decision, to say that's not really something I want to embark on today, wherever that's okay too, or I'm not at that moment, versus, as soon as I hear it, it's no right. You know you're going like that's no, but it's this idea of you're in control of it. You're in control of the curiosity, you're in control of the the journey, you're in control of getting the feedback and and the planning or not planning, and then then the documentation of this all. I really love that because again it goes back to the inspiration, because they think in that framework you can find inspiration to find the right path. You can also find the right teacher. You could be the right teacher for someone, because it's that sense of movement forward versus getting so bogged down in the minutia today or limiting yourself from trying something new. Because, as you said back when we were talking about the leaders who don't want to move forward, I'm really comfortable in what what, what's what has always been. But the world could have moved by and you're still stuck in the way you did it before or your fear of moving forward. So I really and I think that goes back to your point, then you could end up at the top of the ladder on the wrong mountain because you're so adamant about this is the way I have to do it, or I've convinced myself to do it, because you've lost the novelty or creativity. Absolutely, absolutely, just love that what you've taken out so far the book and I'm I can't wait to see what you come back with after you read it because, yeah, your insights are spot on. It's beautiful. Now this is going to be one that I'm going to get some copies and send the people and say, just just read this one. So so listen. First off, I want to thank you for taking time to chat with me. I this has been a really fun conversation. I think it's pivoted into a lot of different directions, but I think this last conversation about the book has really sort of connected everything to it. So first off, thank you so much. So, but at the end of every episode we do five or six questions. I call them the one meaning, one word, one thought that comes in when you ask. They have nothing to do with anything, but they're sort of get to know Tony Behind the MIC. So first question that we always ask people is food, because people love food. What's the one food that is...

...your Goto? I love to I cannot do without. Oh my gosh, I wouldn't say that it has to be Chocko chockets of cookies are just like my that it's my my guilty pleasure, that that's the guilty but I used to say guilty pleasure and people were going, why don't we read guilty? I'm just saying, okay, what's the One? You could do with them? All right. Number two. Place that you would like to travel that you have not been to yet? Turkey. It's been I'm list for a long time and unfortunately a lot of things have helped me back, but I'm a fan of architecture and it's one of the things that I want to see before I die. There you go. What is something that you are reading or listening to that is inspiring you right now that you would recommend other people? I went back and listened to an old book that I love. It's called illuminate by Nancy Darte. Oh, Nancy Doors, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, I know, okay, great, go we'll put that into the list to what's one trick that you do to get yourself back on track when you feel you've drifted off. It's called expand your vision. Narrower. I look at what's possible, okay, and I focus in narrow down. Okay, great, love that. Okay, just a couple more. If I got all of your friends, family, close people who really know Tony, put them in a room and said, describe Tony In one word, what would it be? Oh my gosh, it would be probably two words, and it's courageous, Pioneer. We love that. Yeah, right, and it's there's something about it, because I take a lot of leaps into the unknown and very courageous in the work that I do. I wouldn't personally call myself that, but it's something that other people have said. That's who you are. I'm more humble and listen. It's okay. That's why we're asking that, when we're not asking you what you think of yourself. Last question before we wrap up. We've talked about a lot of different things and there's a lot of fun, but if there was one thing, just one thing, that you would want listeners to take away with one lesson, what would that lesson be? Yeah, that one lesson would be half more honest conversations with yourself so that you can dig deeper into what you really want. Right, great, love that. Love that. So again, Tony, thank you so much. So please. So I'm sure we can get the book on Amazon Right. But what I want to know is where can people connect with you? So, you know, social media, website, talk to me. So this way we can link all that up and they can reach out to you if they so choose. Fantastic and, first of all, thank you so much for having me in the show. This has been so enjoyable. The best place to find me is on my website, which is inspired purpose coachcom, and you can find off I all all types of great stuff there. My podcasts is a great place to find out more about me, the Virtual Campfire and my book you can purchase on Amazon to called the sorry climbing the right mountain. I was going. I know that title. I got I know the title of Your Book, and I guess the last place would be linked in. I'm I'm very active on Linkedin's you can find me there. Great and will put all those in the show notes as well. So again, if you if you're interested in reaching out Tony, please do as you get a sense of who he is during this conversation. I think it's someone that you definitely should connect with. So again, Tony, thank you so much. I appreciate you being here. So, everyone again, please don't forget to subscribe to the podcast on Apple Or, if you're an android user, to go over there to spotify as well. You can jump over to the Youtube Channel and see the conversation between the two of us. Please make sure you head over to Glen Pastcom as well. You can download some pre materials. Please make sure you share the episode. Sure there's a lot of people that could benefit from what Tony just said. Rate the PODCAST. That helps us spread the word as well. I know there's a lot of places that you can consume content, but the fact that you spend some time with Tony and myself today means the world. And, as I say at the end of every show, you're in charge, but now, Tony gave you a few more tools to help you become more successful, both professionally and personally. I look forward to seeing you on the next episode. Thanks again, Tony. Thanks you create it so much. All right, take care,.

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