"You're In Charge" with Glenn Pasch
"You're In Charge" with Glenn Pasch

Episode 93 · 3 weeks ago

Customer Experience is Your Competitive Advantage with Lyamen Savy

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Building a business is challenging. Generating happy customers is also a key for success. But which comes first, the business or the customer experience? 

In this episode, Lyamen Savy, founder of 321 Ignition shares her thoughts on how she built her business, culture and experience coming first.

Her commitment to customer experience came from her journey from refugee, to Microsoft, to the banking industry to now running a technology firm

Her commitment to her culture came from her journey from refugee, to Microsoft, to the banking industry to now running a technology firm. 

Her passion is contagious and her tactical advice is priceless. 

I am sure you will enjoy the conversation as much as I did. 

Enjoy, subscribe, share and don't forget to comment. 

About Lyamen Savy 

Ms. Lyamen Savy is the CEO and founder of 321 Ignition, a Seattle-based startup focused on helping car dealerships evolve to meet the next generation of car buyers’ demands online and in the showroom. 

Previously she was the Senior Global Marketing Manager at Microsoft, where she exceeded the company sales goals by 80% and scaled the footprint of Office 365 SMB Direct channel from 12 countries to 41 in one year’s time. This earned her the company’s coveted internal award of “Customer Obsessed Employee.” 

She brings over 18 years of sales and marketing expertise and her vast knowledge in the digital space coupled with her focus on customer experience to the automotive industry. Her unique background has steered 321 Ignition’s mission to enhance the car buying journey for the next generation, while identifying ways to increase profitability and efficiency for car dealerships. 

With her business partner and 321 Ignition Co-Founder, DJ Haddad, they have decades of combined experience leading successful campaigns for Fortune 100 brands and fast-growing retail and technology companies. They now bring these insights and proven approaches and analytical methodologies to car dealerships in order to help them engage millennial and Gen Z customers.  

The daughter of a Russian refuge, Ms. Savy came to America as a teenager in the late 80’s and quickly adapted to a new language and culture while relying on food stamps during the transition. Her passion and drive to live fearlessly has continued be at the forefront of every decision she has made. Ms. Savy graduated from the University of Washington with a business degree and has an Associates Degree from Bellevue College in Web Multimedia Authoring. Her first car was a 1986 Pontiac Sunbird.   

www.321ignition.com

About her journey to America...

https://medium.com/authority-magazine/lyamen-savy-of-321-ignition-i-am-living-proof-of-the-american-dream-25ef99aa504f

About Glenn Pasch: 

"Everyone finds themselves in charge at some point in their lives. Yet many of us lack the skills to generate consistent results. My goal is to help you learn the skills to adapt and grow in your personal and business life.”

Glenn Pasch is CEO of PCG Digital, a full service digital marketing agency that specializes in helping businesses create and deliver customers raving, recommending & returning for more. He is author of 2 books including "The Power of Connected Marketing" and has spoken and educated audiences throughout the US and internationally.  

Let’s Connect: 

Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/glennpasch/​

Personal Website http://glennpasch.com/​

Company website: https://pcgdigital.com/

Support for this episode comes from P CG digital. It is anywhere from difficult to impossible to manage everyaspect of the changing digital landscape. Rather than trying to do ityourself, why not leave it to an award winning team of Digital MarketingSpecialists who have mastered it all connect your message with morepotential customers with P C G digit go to P C G Digital Com for moreinformation experience is a competitive advantage.Let me repeat that customer experience is a competitive advantage. That iswhat my guest today on the podcast Lyman Savvey, who is the CEO of threetwo one ignition a website provider for what omotic dealers believes she hasfocused her company on delivering customer experience to her clients. Shehas focused her company on creating an environment, a culture where customerexperience matters, but also the customer experience inside her buildingand she talks about how she built it and why it's important. We talk abouthiring people for that customer experience, as well as where businesseshave to focus over the next five years, or else they're going to be left behindit's a fascinating journey. As she tells me, she came to the United Statesat nine years old from Russia, so that impacted her. Her whole work ethic, herbelief of. If you want to be successful in the United States, there is so muchabundance. You can be successful to her journey through sales marketing workingat Microsoft, working at startups and now starting her own company, which isincredibly successful. It's a phenomenal story. She has so muchpassion you she just bouncing out of her seat. You can hear it on the audio.You can watch it on the video. She is just an amazing guest, so I can't waitfor you to hear what Liman Savvey has to say. So, let's dive into today'sepisode of urine charge conversations that spark change with lyman savvy okay. So let me, let's just jump rightin what I am fascinated with in your journey and how you came on to. I don'twant to say my radar, but people were talking about you and your company andwhat they really focused on was not so much the technical aspects of yourproduct, but it was how you were focused on customer experience really was sort of that lens thateverything went through for you, and so I want to start out by asking you whenI say those words customer experience one. What do they mean to you andnumber two? Where do you see companies missing theboat on customer experience, great question so Glenn? I think it wasabout fifteen years ago. You know, I lived here in Washington, stayed thehome of North Romes, the Microsoft of the world, and you know all those bigcompanies and about fifteen years ago I went to a conference here. Howardshouts from starbuck CEO founder talk about customer experience. Actually, no sorry it was yeah was howwas shows- and he was talking about the customer experience. He said Dick aguess- who's number one in customer experience, and so normally I thoughtit was. He was going to say nostrums because everybody who knows marshamsthey know the Norseman was about as some experience and he said it'sactually, it's not Norsham's it's Amazon and the reason why Amazon isnumber one in customer experience because custom experience doesn't justmean what was the customer experience during business hours when a customersat the store talking to somebody face to face, but what was their experiencelike with your company on weekends, two...

...o'clock in the morning when thebusiness shut down? So it's really about the digital journey? It's allabout experience on any device. So in any situation, whether it's in personor online, whether it's a mobile or a dust up, and basically how easy is itfor somebody to get what they need the information they need the questions toanswer to get the help that they need. So to me, customer experience isbasically what is the full interaction a customer has with your business atany time and in given time. Okay so- and I agree with you- so let's go downthis because I love where we're going here. Okay, so then we all do hold upthe Nordstrom, the you know, even starbucks, and the Amazons and Disneys,and all these other companies for experience. So where do companies get it wrong?Where did they miss out? You know. What's interesting. Is I see the future where every company isgoing to become a technology company? So right now, when you look at theglobal economy, there's about twenty seven industries and technology is oneof those industries, but in the next ten years, if you askseventy two percent, according to one of the survey, a research I sell byforester, they actually talk about theirs. Twenty seven industries, one ofthose industries, is technology industry and back in the days you knowyou used to compete against the company across the street from you and you'redoing things, maybe ten percent better. Now every company is becoming liketechnology like every day we're reading about how there's another car companythat's more like a technology company like you that it operates like Tesla orlike a brace like room of the world. If you think about, for example, Ober Uber is a technologycompany, so they don't replace a taxi, they became a technology company doordash they're, not just you know, grocery deliver deliver ears, theirtechnology company, so really the future is that every company is goingto become a technology company. So technology is no one we're going to bein the industry. It's going to be of how every industry that's business andso to me customer experiences. How do we leverage how? How do we usingtechnology to improve the customer experience, whether it's online oroffline or in person, and everything else in between okay? So let me let mepush back on that. To get get your opinion on this. I think you're rightand I agree with you that technology is important, but do you think that it isthat, in your experience that sometimes it's the cart before thehorse, meaning they get a piece of technology and then try to figure outhow to wrap their culture around it, verses understanding who they are as abusiness and then finding the technology to suit them? Do you seethat as a disconnect? Definitely I mean, for example, thisIRA retail. You know disour retail, picking this hot buzz word, especiallyduring the pandemic, and I always talk about how digital Resa is just acheckout button, and so what we're missing is the full experience exactlywhat you just said, Glen is that you know I adopt to deal ships all the timethey put on this fancy digital retail to on their website, but they'recompletely neglecting the overall experience of the website right. So whocares? If you have a you know digital regal button on your website whennobody, I can find it when the website is so hard to navigate and it's notbuilding trust with consumers, so it is putting the. How did you say what that English is mysecond language? So what's that thing we put the card pork before the HorseRight, yeah they're, putting the DISERTA to but they're completelymissing the whole point of. What's the experience like before somebodyactually starts using the tol, so so for so walk me through then yourmindset, as you and your partner, you...

...know, or Bilbil this company buildingthis technology to to serve that end right to make it easy for a customer tofind information, get their questions answered again. Is it that people are not to your point, notthinking through how all of the this technology impacts all of theirprocesses? I use the image of an octopus where,let's say your website is the head of the octopus, but you have all thesetentacles going out into your business dealership. I know we both serveautomotive for a large number of our clients, but any business. It'sunderstanding that is my website. My online business set up in a verysimilar manner to if they came into my brick and mortar retail location. Youknow, am I answering questions the exact same way? Is it easy for them tofind that so for you, when you were building your platform, was thatimportant to you to make sure that customer experience ease abuse was for front for your clients? One hundredpercent, though one I always say the devil, is always in the detail, detailsmatter and that's been so ingrained on me as a child by my grandma. You knowmy grandma she's, a Russian strong, stoic woman and she was still youalways say you know. If you're going to do something, do it all the way, don'tdo a half fast job, and so we started building our company. I literallyobsess over a little detail like I didn't sleep, probably for the firstsix months. You know what, as I was, injuring a brand new industry and knewnothing about. I knew there was a problem and I knew other industrieswere doing and I knew there was a huge opportunity to innovate and distrust,but I didn't know anything about automotive industry. I don't know whowere the major players or anything, and so I obsessed over every single littledetail and that's what you know it takes to besuccessful is that you knowlike when I listen to Ellen Muss. He cracks me up. You know in one of theinterviews he talks about how he's like, if my average competitor works. Fortyhours a week and he's like and I'm working eight hours a week and onyou're Stan for an can you imagine how far off I'm going to be o compared tomy competitor, we, and so I have that work. I think that it's very hard to bevery few people could work as as long as I can I'm like a machine, and so youknow- and I care so much about the details. Details is everything and whenI talk to our customers even like, when we on board him and a lot of times, youknow after dealsh go live, they'll, send us a you, know their party widgetsand normally you know the vendors who they sign up with you know trade ontools or whatever witchet they buy those vendors war. Just sport, US andEmo, saying please add a here. Here's your year here and I train my team.Don't you stake? You know somebody's email and just do it. Let's care, let'sget on the call with a customer and really understand. Why did the bit thisdo what problem with the in, for how do we actually create a better experience,is great at the got a great new wig and grant you to if it's soling a problem,but what the experience? What's the customer experience and the really themost important thing is caring. Unfortunately, you know a lot ofbusinesses today. It's all about profit, profit, profit, it's all about. Let'sjust do it fast. Let's just see you know, you know, market US checked down andthey don't care about the details and I obsess over details. That's the thingis no, and I think that's a great point- and you know I've seen it as well. I've hadconversations weakly about this, of adding widgets or products or toolswithout thinking for the end user right a lot of times, it's very top downdecisions, meaning this works for us as the business owner. In this case, anautomotive dealer will say well, this will work for me and there's some blank space on thewebsite. Let's put it there without...

...thought to your point, is, it seems,like you, work from the not reverse reverse engineer is the wayI will call. We started the customer experience and work backwards and sayif we're going to use this, let's first understand why we have this. Why didthe dealer get this and then, where would it work best to serve both sides,meaning the dealer gets what they want, as well as the the customer gets, whatthey want and that and that could go for ordering pizzas ordering cosmeticsordering. You know your travel agency, you know to your point, is alwaysthinking through. Is this benefiting the customer in being able to use ourproduct, in this case a website to interact with you in a way that is easyand fast and simple versus complex yeah? I always do dealerships that customerexperience is number one and then your own internal operations. You know a lotof time, SAC dealerships, they focus so much on how to make their VDCdepartments you know more efficient or how to make their selves people lifeeasier and everything, but at the expense of a consumer and the customeris the most important thing without a customer. It doesn't matter. If youhave, you know ten people in to be DC department sitting there like customers,everything, and so it's really really important to first think about thecustomer and have empathy like put yourself in the shoes of a customer.You know like with the my company with since widville website. You know everytime I tax it's brand new dealers who you know never seen our solution oranything, and I ask them what do you think about how you're whatthe user experience in on your website I'll be like? Oh It's great, I'm likewhen was the last time you looked at your website on a mobile device insteadof when you're at the dealership in the office on a computer. When, like it'sreally putting yourself in the shoes of a consumer- and you know one of thethings that we talk about the Glen in the business world, you have differenttypes of competitive advantages, so one of your competitive advantages could beprice leadership, meaning, like you, have the lowest cost provider. Nobodycould beat you on your price. Well, unless you're a walmart you're, nevergoing to be able to compete on price, because that requires volume, so localdelation could never. You know compute them on value their own control, theprice of their cars like if you know the market dic takes whatever the priceof the curse. That's what it is. So price leadership is not a competerevantage for a dealership, nor is a sustainable, competitive avenge. Thenext competitive advantage could be prod a differentiation again for mostcompanies. They have no control of the product just like dealerships. Theydon't produce their own cars like I produce my own product, so I havecontrol of what features I built. Would it help make my product unique? And Ithen I could whatever I want. Dealers have no control of the product, theydon't mean you set your cars, they could. You know, of course, maybe buycertain cars at the UNCTIONS or whatever at the V, but they still haveno control of the product. Third Competitive Advantage is s customerexperience, and that is once staying about competitor vantagebecause providing a good customer experience doesn't really cost much.You know if you, if you think about it. Well, I think it could enter and Ithink some of the push back is it cost time it causes effort. It cost work ona consistent basis to make sure you're delivering that experience over andover and over again versus buying a widget and you buy it and itworks and- and you don't have to pay attention to it anymore. So I agree,and I think that is it's totally within any business owners. Control of that isa competitive advantage. I actually think it's a waste of time and money ifthey're not actually investing in the customer experience, because heredealerships are actually spending money on these widgets. You know eighthundred dollar sears five hundred is there and really it's actually onlycannibalizing their current results, because if they would have justactually improved the experience they...

...want to have to spend that money on athose widgets and it's a reducing trust with consumers, which is another thing.So there's a very, very famous book they read. Actually I went through awhole week training, so I used to work a capital one which is a bank, and youknow in a banking world. Trust is everything if customers don't trust youthey're, never going to bank with you like. Can you imagine the how importantto trust this to your bank? So as a marketer, I had to go through a week,long training and I had to read books about it and ever everything it'scalled leading at a speed of trust and basically what it talks about. Whathappens when an organization has high trust versus low trust, with consumerswith employees but partners with everybody else? What happens is whentrust is low and trust is down. Speed goes down as go up when trust is high.Speed goes up. Cause goes down so, but trust you can't build trust with thepoor experience there they're going to go hand in hand. It's like you can haveone with that, the other and so imagine now, when the consumers coming to yourwebsite or interacting with your dealsh, so actually here's a birthday example.So I least my cars. I don't buy cars because I like to change cars everythree years. I, like you, gases new widgets, so I least my cars. So mylease is up for renew for my Mercedes and this weekend is so Mameri when youin December. So I got the letter, you know start looking for a new car. Youknow here's your options, so I want to get a convertible. So I went a coupleof Mercedes dores websites some and there is a convertible that I found onthe websites listed of m a r P. Well, I work in out o motor industry, so I knownot to buy cars for MS R B, so I contacted the dealership. So I callthem- and I come to Jo ship saying here. What can I deal? Can you guys give mefor this car and I think in we're going to give me a better zeal than aMassarli tit on their website right? The Guy He's like oh well, he's like.Let me calculate this for you and then he called me in the phone and said theundher website was listed for fifty solar in a RP he's courting me. Seventythousand I'm like Hundi you get to twenty sand. Ingres is like wellthere's you know, there's Texas, there's a registration of like Texasregistration does not cost twenty and dollars was like there's also becauseof there's a microchip shortage and there's a you know, love you know, there's a spike anddemand and the not enough supply. Whatever he's like we have about. Fivethousand dollar mark up were up church. He said, and in my God he's like a justlike a housing mark and like well. First of all, cars are not a house aswho houses in Grease in value cars. I crest and value right he's like there's.Also fifteen sand of value at services. He's like that. Our customers reallyappreciate. So we included our pricing. So at this point, can you imagine whatmy trust is with a dealership door and that's what the coved is over andepademic is over and everything I will never in a million years by from thisdealership, they are forever ruin to trust with me, so for them to preparetrust with me. It's going to take so much more time resource and by the way,I feel the story out to several people right. You, probably you probably won'teven give them the opportunity to try to rebuild their trust. No, and I meanand the it's everything the experience is their website experience because Icouldn't get their information in oude on the website. Side did pull theminstead of actually being able to do everything, I need to do in researchand compare and then to just the interaction with the with the employee.I mean, like I was so close to actual reporting to the I'm like isn't thisillegal? You can't price the vehicle, one pre rise in the website and thentry to Epsom is twenty thousand dollars. Above I mean like a this. Is Insane soyou know leading a speed of trust. I think everybody needs to read that book,regardless of what industry you're in and go through that training. Whathappens I'm trying now- and I think this is a perfect example of when thebalance we forget that it's customer experience to your point earlier on,where you were saying it all becomes about profit, because I can that's not a good enough reason. Butlet me take a step back to your point. Is If you price the vehicle at D-Seventy thousand, for instance, on the...

...website, and then you said it's seventytousand dollars. Then then there is you may not like the price, but there's aconsistency where you could trust you. May You may think it's out of that's acrazy price for the car. But what you were saying is this idea of. I see onething I talk to. I get another answer and I think a cross everybody who'slistening should be thinking about that in your own business is. Are there anyfriction points in your process of interacting with your customers, wherethey could get two different answers? Depending on who they spoke with atyour company- and that's really important because to Lyman's point- isthis that I er it begins a roting trust. It allows somebody's guard to stopstart going up to say: HMM, I don't like where this is going, and it'sreally important for you to understand that. So let me pivot to one on thisidea of customer experience, so so put your marketing hat on. Because again,you are not only see of your company and you, as I said earlier on, youyou've done it all. You've done the sales you've done the marketingbuilding projects. You know incredibly successful in all of those areas. Where do you see and we can focus on automotive becausewe're both there, but in any industry? Why are we so hesitant about marketingthe experience we're going to give to consumers if that's really thatimportant to them verses were always just talking about price, I think, because in automotive at leastI don't think enough. People realize the impact of a customer experience.Yet you know when, when I talk to new dealerships about our product and whenI show them our result, the dealership see it the minute they switch to ourplatform. The numbers are so high that nobody even believes it like dealers, cincrease of five hundred percent and lead volumes and doubling their salesand everything I mean usually like. If you can improve your business by tenpercent fifteen percent, you think you're doing great right when they seethose numbers. The first question people always ask me is like what elsedo you guys do? Did you guys increase their marketing spend? Did you guys dothis? You guys so then I'm like? Oh, we literally just improved the customerexperience and the is just that an auto motor. For some reason, people underestimate the power of acustomer experience and I think it's going to start to change. I mean, ifyou think about it, I I was to talk about Karvan Car Max. They will havethe cheapest prices. The only difference they have is the customerexperience. People want to save time- and I always say you know, rich peopleby time which people so you know, spend money to buy more time. So if yourdealings hip could help a consumer safe time and they trust you even if theyknow they're spending a thousand dollars more with you buying the sameguard a bit- that's fine. My time is worth more than that now and I thinkthat's that's really important for everyone to listen to because part of it is. You know certainindustries. As you said, you know I think new. Your number was twenty sevendifferent industries. Every industry is changing at different times. The amazons on the world and onlineshopping for certain purchases has evolved to the point where I don't haveto go anywhere. I can just type something in and it arises on mydoorstep and we've even gotten to your point about time. It used to be Amazonwas a week two weeks and who cares now? If it's not here by tomorrow, I'mfrustrated this is not working anymore. I think certain in into your pointabout door dash. Where now do I want to go pick up my take out food or havesomeone bring it to me and is it worth paying ten dollars to have someone elsebring it to me versus me, get in my car and dry? All of these. These decisionsnow are based on what's my time worth,...

...and am I willing to pay for it, I think,in terms of automotive, I think what we're seeing is this transition, butwe're seeing we have a front row seat to the fight between this is the waywe've always done it to this is the way we're heading and that fight of you're,seeing the some percentage or just jumping rightin and going ye ha. Let's go. You have the other people who are staunchlysaying I'm not even paying attention and then people in the middle going. Idon't trust it, I'm not sure really. I got to try got to change, but I thinkwe're seeing this people questioning. Why do I have tospend all this time? Why is it so hard? Why? Why can't I get just one price?Why are there three or four prices and again, I think they understand you know by like a lone that concept ofmaybe my credit score isn't, but to your example: heree the price is allover the place it just the roads trust. So so, if somebody's coming to you andsaying how do I fix it, let's say they. Someone comes to you and says: How doyou help me? Who should they look? First, I mean it depends which part of thebusiness. Of course they want to fix. The customer experience, of course,through to an ignition, were mobile first website provider. So we couldhelp fix that problem. One of the challenges that are at least mycompetitors to have that's my hypothesis. Of course, I don't workthere, so I don't have insight, but my hypothesis is, you know in a technologyworld there's this problem called technology legacy problem the older thecompany they're harder is for them to innovate because they have accumulatedso much tech that you know over at the time you Colemore for more, and so youknow, if you want to change or fix a problem. The question is: Can Yourcurrent provider affect that or they have so much technology that, eventhough they're big and they have the resources, but they are so manyadvantages in their platform that they're going to have to really do onwhat to fix. It is to you know, rebuilt right, right, yeah, and so that'sactually gives my company a Hue competere advantage, because they'veonly been around for two and a half years, we're building things the rightway from the beginning, one because we already know what the right thing to doversus you know. Some of the older companies have been around. You knowthe issues with them. A lot of these legacy industries and the legacyindustry like automotive to motive is one of the oldest industries. You, whatare they re? Eight percent of a GDP? You know huge industry, so there's alot of really really old companies out in here and they have a problem withthe their technology being really really old. So do you think what's hardinterrupted? Do you think also because I like what you just said, they're,like a legacy text tack? Do you think it's also a legacy mentality? That's aproblem of changing one hundred percent. So you know when I work the MicrosoftSatia, the new Co after Bill Gates when a city became the CEO of microscope,the stuck price of microscope, I believe, was like thirty, seven orforty dollars a share. Last Friday, Microsoft hit a three hundred dollars ashare, and while I was there, the way Satya was doing it is. He was changing.The company Culture Micros has been around for God, O seven years. I forgotwhat is it fifty sixty years? I don't know how many years they've been around,but their legacy company, and so he changed the company culture based onthis very famous book which, by a highly recommend everybody to read it,it's called growth mindset and in a automotive industry, we're missing thatwe're missing the growth mindset. You know the opposite of growing my girthmind set is six mindset. Is You know we're all saying that this is got we'vealways done it? We're afraid of change were afraid of failure, but you have toembrace change right, and so I mean, if you take the chapter from you know withSati. That I mean. Can you imagine changing a company that it's a...

I didn't, have a trillion dollars, aREVENI forgot. How I mean I think they bounced over a trillion at one time butthey're pretty close yeah. So I mean how do you change a company that has ahundred forty send employees a hundred fifty sand partners? Ninety sevenpercent of a Microsoft partner revenue revenue comes from partner ecosystemright, so the only way to change it is to change your mind that girls mindset-and you know right now. As you know, you know during the pandemic, dealersbeen making record gross profits because of a shortage vinent andthere's all this extra income, because people are not traveling and stuff likethat, and so a lot of people are just being so focused on to day that they'remissing that the fact in the next five years. The industry is that going to beunrecognizable the fact that a forester analyst is saying that seventy sixpercent of CEOS across the world and every industry is saying that theirbusiness model is going to be unrecognized but five years. That says something to me and so anydealer or any other business owner who is not being attention to that they'reliterally have their hands stuck in the sand. Ei Say, and I think to your pointI think that's why I love this conversation be and why I really wantedto have you on is because you always have talked from the firsttime. I heard you speak. It's always about customer experience. Everythingyou're doing is for that trying to remove a friction. Point simplifyingthe experience, and I agree with you. I think any business owner who is notthinking about how am I making it easier for mycustomers either to interact with us or, as you said, build up that consistenttrust level that someone has their back they're, always looking for that newadvantage, they're looking down the road, I think you're right. I think there'sgoing to be a lot of times where all of a sudden, a business is going to turnaround and they're they're too far behind their competitors, without evenknowing it yeah. You know it. You just Goso my twin sister. She used to workfor B. She actually now works at Oracle, and you know at HB. It's also a legacycompany they've been around for gun as go long. They required so manycompanies. A lot of their technologies are not speaking to each other. Youknow, there's a lot of issues and she is in charge of. She was in charge oftheir global enterprise sales. Where I care she would close. Five hundredmillion dollar deals with the Amazon. Like I mean what a how many cells,people close a five hundred million dollar sales contracts- and so one ofmy favorite closes, she always says- is that whenever she's trying to get acustomer to buy something, she focuses on a customer. Experience got to maketheir life easier, as I have a high tolerance for my own thing, but I havevery low tolerance for my customer, Spain and if you think about what she'ssaying, is that whenever she's trying to do something that has never beendone before, whether it's in the industry, whether it's her company,because it's your old company she's like I will figure out a way to do itmanually, even though it's going to be extremely painful in terms of you know,process and everything else, but I'm going to figure out how to do it tomake sure the customers happy and then I'm going to figure out how to make it.You know more scalable in the back Gand, so she has a high teller ance for herown being and very low tolerance for her customers. Bane she's been a lovethat I love to see. Again. I want to just pause for men to hope peopleunderstood what that was that what you just said. You know you as there's toomany businesses that it's reversed I want to make without. I don't thinkit's a conscious effort to say I'm going to make ittough for my customers, it's just this balance of when I'm making changes andthings are evolving. I want to make you know, I'm hoping to make it easier forUS internally to do our jobs, because I'm also with my employees, and theywant to be I'm trying to make them happy and make it easier for them aswell, but I don't think they always put everydecision through that Lens to say. Is this continuing to make it easier formy customers to interact with us at the same moment in time making my employeeshappy, but I like what you did hey. We...

...might have to suffer a little bit inhere, but to keep were keeping our customers happy and then phase two willbe, let's figure out how we can make it easier for ourselves first, but alwaysserving the customer. First, exactly you know at the Three Twenty Commission,I've always said were from day one who have been customer first partner. FirstMobile First, you know, customers are number one star our partners at number.Two because you know without customers, it doesn't matter if partners knowwhere exist right then we're the last ones. So, like you know, being astartup, we went through a lot of pain. You know, like especially me. You knowworking weekends and everything, but that's okay. As long as you know. First,I figure out how to make my customers the happy as they could ever be and themost successful they could ever be, and then I'm figuring out. Okay, now thatwe figure this out now, it's you or how to make everybody else happy too, andif my employees or any other company business owners their employees are,you know complaining, which is why a lot of times businesses were prioritizetheir employees instead of customer. Well, then you have a cultural problem,then you, maybe you don't have the right people on the, but you know youknow that famous book good to great. You know first who who's on the bus andthen where you take the bus, so you know, if dealerships, I think, mightsometimes also have a cultural problem problem because a lot of people- aDelius, worked there for many many years and that's just how they're usedto doing things in so they're their resistance change. So so I'm glad youbrought up that that the word is, you said: digitalretailing gets band, you know thrown around all the time. I think culturegets thrown around a lot. So, let's pivot on to that, because I'm Iwant to pick your brain about that because, as I said, you've done, you'veworked for the microsofts. You've worked for big banks. You know you've worked in smallercompanies, so talk to me about this journey thatyou had of building this and you're. You know three twenty ignition buildingit with that sense of what the culture was, because there's people out therewho are going to in your same shoes saying I'm starting something or I'm incharge of this team or I'm in charge of this division and they're. Lookingaround going yeah, I hear about culture, but I don't know how to build it or Idon't know how to maintain it or I'm not even sure what it is. It soundslike you had a very conscious vision of what you wanted, your to company to bemeaning your employees and work environment. Yes, we know about thefocus on the customer experience and that's a priority, but internally walk me through some of the ways thatyou made decisions about how you wanted your company to run interact grow sothat those listeners who are having those same challenges can take sometactical things away. But you know how earlier said the leding at a speed of trust that has todo with both customers partners the same with employees. I am a verytorough about how I document things and how I communicate things becausethere's a lot of goes on in my little bride and it's very, very important andto make sure that you know when I'm communicating my vision that everybodyreally understands and so like, for example, even when I went to one of theconferences- and there was so much to report to my team- and we have a prettybig team and my team is a round the world like we've been remote from dayone which, as you could imagine, that a lot of companies were struggling duringManami like Oh, my God, how do we not show up? You know to work, or arepeople going to be productive? We've been a remote from day one. What thathas allowed us to do one is to recruit the top talent anywhere in the worldversus like I live here in Seattle. Good Luck! Finding good employee, likeI'm, competing against literally every big joint company United States, is andsea like right. I'm not going to be able to find you know going to employes.You want to go to a starter because...

...startups are risky, so, like even like,when I was leaving Microsoft, I can imagine I'm giving up my bonuses, mystock options. My four one K, my amazing benefits and everything. So,like you know, how do you find you know? How do you get somebody unless you're aCO and insane? How do you going to recruit? You know somebody from thosecompanies to come work at a start up right now. You know by US being aremote and allow me to you know, track the talent from allaround the world, the best talent, but the best thing I think, because we'reremote from day on when we're interviewing people, I've always saidin mind, like can this person be trusted to work on our own right, yeahE, not checking in they're, not clucking out, and you know right now.What's that phrase O we have a knowledge economy. You know back in thedays. You know when you have factory workers, you know they clock in clackout, and so your productivity was measuring the hours you worked andeconomy. You know market, it's not about how many hours it's about youroutput, and so you know our company culture from day. One like I don't giveif you work on. You know if you have take your kids to school or they have ayou know, braces and dentistic women whatever. As long as you get your workdone, even if it takes you one hour to get work on the tick for other people,six hours great, take the rest of six hours off. I don't care, you know it'sa knowledge economy and so the to me company culture, it's all about one asa leader has to be very transparent and even though in my head, I'm like, Oh,my God, I think I've repeated this like at least a hundred times there ingperson- and I have to do it. So I try to document things document documentdocument and always reference things and the process where you organizethings where somebody goes and finds which my business partner is a hundredcents better at it than I am you my best part no, now were great complimentto each other. He's more of a process oriented and I'm more the crazyinnovative person that comes to pushing the addest, and he always brings meback to reality and says: Let's document this and let's you know,create a process around it and that that's very similar to my brother andmyself, you know he's he's, probably built a little more like you in theideas and let's go when I see what's around the corner, let's go and I'm theone who would build the processes and say: Okay! Well, let me build it andhe's pulled me a little out to be more ideas and I've pulled him back a littleto say no before we do it, let's document doesn't want to slow them down.So it sounds like you know: you're the gas pedal and your partners a littlebit of the break, not riding the break, but just enough to make sure we're not going off the roadbut see what I like about what you just said and again folks. If you're listeningthere, you speak very quickly. No, but there's so much in it. I hopeeveryone's really listening or pausing it or going back and listening to itagain the whole concept of over communication. I don't think you canover communicate now you can over communicate poorly, but to your point,if you're clear on the vision talking in clear, actionable steps that thensomeone can execute on. But the other point is document documentingconversations documenting processes that allows people to gain what youwere saying earlier that speed of trust, because if I trust this is the process,I don't have to think about it anymore. Because here are the steps I do now. Ican go fast because I know the steps, but if I'm always guessing what Lymanreally means or I'm always looking over my shoulder going, am I doing the rightthing? I can't run fast because my eyes are not directed at the end goal.theether distracted, so so those two points folks over communicate, makesure everyone's clear knows what they need to do and then documenting aprocess, because then the process is repeatable. More importantly, it'sscalable because the next person you hire here's the process, here's what wedo and they go okay and they go versus it's my way. Your way, someone elsesway which just bogs down companies from...

...accelerating yeah yeah and the other thing is. You knowit's really important to hire people with common sense. I always say thatyou know common sense is not coming sense. You know. Sometimes you ofcourse could document things, but also it's really important to hire peoplewho would have well does this, even though it's documentary right here doesthis actually makes sense like let let me ask you that, because someone, Iknow, somebody's going to be sitting right here now saying. Well, how do Iinterview all right, I'm sitting across a dog? How do you it sounds easy,although I'm just going to hire somebody with common sense? How do youfigure that out in the interview process? Oh my God, common sense is thehardest thing to interview for, like literally the artist because so I'malways is like. Isn't this common sense right? This is not common sense. It'sthe funniest thing I mean know when I interview people. Actually you knowwhat I love to ask for, so I don't care about the bedigree of the education andstuff like that, because you know I'm a refuge I came to the United States is ayou know with the running away from the war, and you know we were living onfoot stamps and everything. So I didn't have the luxury you know to go appliedafter school, colloging or activities. You know to get into ivy like schoolsand stuff like that, but I put myself through school through college througheverything I worked. You know during the day went to school at night in anyways you know. I think that actually gave me a lot more made me more a lotmore valuable because, as I was going to school and learning about businesswearing about marketing, I was actually ready doing it. We like, I think Iactually learned a lot more from than the typical couch student. You know whowas in fraternity and you know probably drinking half the time, but you know so. When I interviewpeople I like to know what was their struggle, how resilient are they? Youknow, resilience is another thing and it's a girl mind at versus six mind set.You know, there's three tepes of people and want to have a person. You know whofails and that's o their life is over they're. Just like you know catastrophe.They can't operate again function, they have low self esteem for other times.You know the second type of person, the girls minds. A person is like well,okay. I failed. I learned something from it and the third one where thatactually whatever happened to them, it was a pivotal moment in their life, andso I really like to want interview people to learn about what they'veaccomplished. The most importantly are the inquisitive. If you're inquisitive,a quisitive is almost important. Important thing like, like I saidearlier, you know Gan, I was injuring automotive space knew nothing aboutcards, dealerships never worked at a card dealership in my life, never wouldhave thought in the million years. I would be a car dealership. People haveto Milena, you have no regal experience. Selling cars, what the hell are youdoing, but I'm the most inquisitive person and not to you, know, mis o BrigMyself on, like I'm extruding quisitive, I ask more wise than anybody else. Idrive my friends, not one of my best friends with us, my boy, Dana She's,like you're like the biggest white person. She like, I driver, not s,comin a YS, so if a person is inquisitive that I know that they willfigure things out like it. Even if it's not a document in the process, theywill figure out because they're inquisitive enough to stop and think.Oh wait a minute, even though this road do this. Should I really do it? Youknow you, but I think most Sheos, most like you were saying back with ElonMusk and most most very successful leader cos or justleaders in general. They don't have to have the title of that they're, alwaysasking why they're asking? Why is this being done or why aren't we hitting ournumbers or they're trying to work with their team to say? Well? Why isn't sheable to do this, or why can't I communicate this? It's always movingforward to accomplish the goal versus blaming and I think that's a greatquestion. I ask that in a different way, I'll ask it tell me it s. tell me atime where you ran a project or you were in charge. Something and it didn'twork out, want me through what happened. What I'm listening for is. Are theyblaming other people? Oh, you know. I had a manager and they used to do thisor they didn't give me this or you know...

I had a team and they wouldn't listen.That tells me right there they're not willing to look at themselves versussomeone. I interviewed someone and I hired them and their their answer was.You know we were all working together. I'm not sure I was clear enough. Youknow what I learned was. We need to do X. all of a sudden, it became to yourpoint, inquisitive self, reflective, they're working on themselves to moveforward. I want a team of those people versus it's everybody else's fault, butmine, Yeah and you know my business partner always tells me he's like Lymanis a CEO. Everything is your fault, that's matter what happens, everythingis your fault, and so I could not. I have no right to ever blame anybody inanything. If something didn't go right, where did I mess up like? Did I notcommunicate clearly enough, and I would say like I know, which is my secondlanguage you like? Am I not speaking you English right now? Does everybodyunderstand what I'm saying? Well it chats again- and this is the key andI've worked with some people on that as well, because I feel the exact same way,it's not that they understand you do they understand what they need to dolike, I always say, actions cause results and I've sat there sometimes,and I thought I was very clear and everyone in the room nodded their head.I said: Do you understand what I need and they go? Yes, yes, yes, but what Ididn't take was that c what I learned a long time ago. I have to make sure theyunderstand what they need to physically do. What are the steps are going to do?That then allows them to have the actions to follow because they couldunderstand it, but the picture in their head is different than the picture inyour head and that's when you go wait a minute we missed. Where did that go andwhere did that happen? And but what I love about you, your passion for this,is you know your I'd like to say everybody feels thisway, but I can just feel like bubbling across the microphone and the acrossthe for those of be watching. You can see it you're, bouncing in your seat,the Eneroth Passion of your your love for your team, your love for YourBusiness, to passion. For what you're doing I mean it's just self evident. So what let me so! Let me ask you aquestion then, so I want to just whine to you back a little bit because, asyou said, you were, I think in your bio. You were around ten when you came tothis country. Was that about right? Ten years old and nine years old, nineyears old, okay, so that put you. So let's give you a few years under yourbelt here, your ninth or tenth grade, which probably put you in that fourteenfifteen year old age- are some of these traits. This workethic, this passion, this I'm going to figure it out. I'm going to askquestions. Has that always been here or is it been?You know when you look back at that person, you do you see the seeds of whoyou are right now, or was it something later on thattriggered this evolution to this? These multiple successes that you've had thafe my journey coming here as arefugee, build me who I am today. I mean like a back in a Soviet Union Day,Somini from Azerbijan which use your part of us Sr, and then it collapse,one thousand nine hundred and ninety one. You know so the other countries like what I loveabout America's we have middle class in other countries you either have courtclass or rich class. There is no middle class, and so if you were born foryou're, always going to be poor if you're born rich, you always going tobe a rich, because it's so about bribes, it's all about who knows who who'sgoing to make the call for you, and so, like. I remember like living in a US SRwhen we had stamps. You know that the government would issue us to go by milkto go by. You know potato os or whatever it is, and I have you know somany stories about. You know this incident when there was not enough foodand I coming to America and there's abundance of everything, and I'vealways said you know. If I didn't succeed, is because I don't want itbadly enough everything I want I could get as long as I just wanted badlyenough, and you know coming here with...

...my parents, so you know my mom was justshe didn't even have a high school degree. She had me my twenty age ofseventeen, so I saw how much she struggled you know coming to a newcountry, not speaking the language and then also my step, that was abused. Ifso, we had to run away from him, and so I saw even more how she struggled withfour kids by herself. You know barely spiks, English, no college or highschool education, and so- and you know my mom- had this really powerful topwith me once it was very short talk, but it was a very powerful attack. Itwas the best ac she could have ever gave me and she basically said me mytwin up down. We were living Florida at that time and she said: Listen It'slike I'm a most single mom with four kids. I don't have the energy or thetime to work all day and then a discipline for kids and you know checkit. Did you guys do your homework? Did you do this she's like? If you don'twant to go to school? Fine, you're going to be like me. If you want tomake something better of yourself go study, you have an opportunity here.That was the best dog that she could have ever had. I mean especially youknow, there's so many women who are dependent on a man. You know forfinancial reasons or whatever, and whether during the good situation orPassatas they'll stick with that man because they're, you know afraid youknow to be alone or not sure how to survive, and things like that and mymom was a survivor you like can know to be with you run away and you know sayscrew it. You know and take the four kids. She tell me my sister, thebiggest lesson, the best lesson, and I think that just they in bless, mygrandma was a total workaholic. I mean my grandma is now seventy eight yearsold she was already sixty five years old. She should have been retired. Shehad two jobs and I didn't even know she had two jobs. One of my friends came upto me and said Lyman land. You guys know that your grandma's working twojobs like. Why aren't you guys helping her? I'm, like I didn't know she wasworking to jobs. Then we started helping her. You know basis with thefor Sasa. She stop working like so part of it. I don't know if it's my IDA.This is how you know my biologically a wire, but it's definitely also myenvironment d. You know seeing what what happens when you don't? You knowyou're not in the pend you're, not control of your future, but mostimportantly, I mean in America we have so many opportunities. There's noreason for anybody not to be successful. I mean, of course everybody considersuccess, different things, but, like you know, I have some friends who, asyou know, I there really really high y up, execute I'm not going to a concisewatch it because I don't want to. Then you know what I'm talking about that,but their kids are just really not motivate or accomplished, and they talkabout. You know social justice and things like that. I'm like, or they sayyou know, things like money is not important. I'm like the only reason whyyou're saying money is that once because you grew up privileged rightwhen you want o money. That's why you're saying money's not importantlike wait in take your parents, you know, take the money away and thenwe'll see how money is not important. You know, so it's a, I think, I'm Awathe way. I am a combination of one. You know I grew up board, it's a experienceboth you know extremes and I definitely like the other stim better. You know,and to is just that to me it's my security blanket. If I'm ever in a badposition, I have so much dignity and pride and I I would never be dependenton anyone. I will survive like I always better myself, and you know three isjust the you know. You are your environment than my grandma, you knowand my mom stuff Russian. Ladies in them, they tell me better than that now,but I think that and the reason I've been asking that question of my guestslately is because there's always seeds and I also leave you know part of why Ido this is so that my kids look at this and say: Oh God, Made Sense, Dadunderstood what he was talking about. But it's about that journey becausesometimes, when you're in the beginning of it, you don't see the outside or youdon't or you take some of the that work ethic for granted or e. You just say:Yeah. Well, parents just saying this, but in that nine and tenth grade,because my oldest is now a junior youngest is ineighth grade and I see their development into. What's realizing thateffort matters and yes, there's a...

...security of improvided a roof overtheir head and yes, they have some things, but there's also lessons ofresponsibility and accountability, and I just see it in my oldest son. Now,all of a sudden going o working, that's not doesn't seem like too much fun. Isaid: Well, that's a mental aspect. You have to one find something you want todo, but even if you're doing something that isn't your en goal, it's a mentalattitude of how you approach it every single day, because you're going to doit, so you can spend eight hours being miserable or eight hours at leasttrying to enjoy what you're doing. But I think to you for what it is is thatthat example- and I think I'm going to just make an assumption, but becauseyou said it a couple times seeing the abundance when there was none that it's there. If you want to workfor where people who see the abundant or are used to the abundance, no longersee abundance, they actually in a weird way. Look at it as there's not enough.If that makes sense, it's almost like they look at. It is not enough or theyblame it, as we have too much and therefore ward paralyzed, because Iactually have one woman who is part of the number of it am part of her kidsactually say Mamma your fault, that you give us so much that we're sounmotivated and I'm like that is the most backwards way of thinking about itto a a little bed. Well, I mean again there. There is always that as a parent-it's very you know. It is a battle because you look at times and you saywell, I don't want my children to suffer the way I did and but there'sthere's a difference between giving them everything with no responsibility,no accountability, but still giving them some things. But it is this ideaof well, you have to work around the house and you have to make your bed andyou have to go, get a job or if you want that, I will you know. My fatheralways taught me a very good lesson when we were young, because we weresolidly middle class, as you would say that middle class father worked veryhard, never had to worry for anything for food or a house or anything alongthose lines. But if I wanted a bicycle right, he'd say: Well I'll, buy youthis bicycle and I say, but I want that cool bicycle. He said well I'll, giveyou this much and then you go earn the rest go out and rate leaves and shovelsnow and you do odd jobs around the neighborhood or save your money. Andthen you can go get that so it was this combination I'll give you x, but if youwant why you have to go work for it and I think that you can still do without making your children unmotivated and Ithink that's just a lazy excuse for the children. It sounds like there's, noaccountability other than them. Just saying hey I'll, give you whatever youwant and then then all you're doing is creating children that are going towalk into the workplace and say well, I get whatever I want around here andthat's going to be a root awakeningyeah. You know I watched Barbara Corkran fromthe Corcoran group she's also one of the shark yea. Yes, and I listen to herpodcast and she once said she's like secretly. I always wish my kids wouldsuffer. She was like. I know it's a horrible thing to say as a parent, youknow what your gets to out self for, but she's like, but I want them tosuffer a t a little because unless gets suffer, they don't realize the first ofthey're not grateful for what they have and to they're, just not ambitious ormotivated and driven, and things like that right. I think it's one of myfavorite things and now on have any kids like Glandee, your father and thefact that you have kids, I always say running a company's way easier thanactually raising kids like any, but I think Tho. I think I think you canactually take what you just said to apply it to your your employees,because there are some people that want to make it easy for their employees, sothey end up telling them what to do and reminding them what to do. Instead ofsaying this is your job I'll train you, buteventually you have to do it on your own, so that that has a part of failure to it, meaningyou sometimes have to watch your...

...employees run into the wall, becausethat's the lesson they need to learn. You could scream don't run into thewall, but then they're going to depend on you always, and you have to rememberto tell them don't run into the wall. So it is a little of that and you cantake that from that, because you don't want to make it easy because thenyou're doing their job and you have your own job to do and that and that'snot going to make your company successful. So any analogy, glad thatsee things Im. Somebody says I nocole you to have kids I be like. I do havekids. I would have a foy kids. I got forty kids around here and, Oh, my God,it's you know, that's even yeah, maybe maybe two kids or one kids enough. Soas we were wind down here, I'm first off, I want to tell you. I've justenjoyed our conversation, I'm so happy that you we connected, and you camehere because I think everything that you've been saying is so valuable. As Isaid to you earlier, your passion, your energy, just all of these little bits ofnuggets of information they all connect, but what I always love is everythingstill runs through that end goal of customer experience for your for yourcustomers. So as we wind down here as we do at the end of every episode, weask a few of these. I call them behind the Mike Questions. Get to know youjust random questions have nothing to do with anything else, just to know a little bit more aboutyou. So what first thing pops into your head comes into it so give me a place that you want to travelto that. You haven't been to yet Brazil, HMM, Brazil. Okay, if you Idon't know if there was, I don't want to say your last meal or a cheat meal,something you shouldn't really eat, but your love eating it anyway. What's thatsecret little thing that you go shouldn't really do it, but I'm goingto eat it anyway, ice cream, any particular flavor or just ice cream ingeneral, usually ice cream. But CHACKLA is my favorite flavor, but I'm obsessedwith the ice cream. Okay, I like that you, you and my son will get along. Hethinks he thinks ice cream is its own food group, so I think he eaten verywell. Okay, now, you've, given us two books, growth mindset, speed of trust, what something else that you're readingor listening to, or maybe it's a podcast something that inspires youthat you say to others. You should listen to this or read this well. One of the things that I'mabsolutely obsessed about when is everything I read is about business,because I'm obsessed with business but thing that I'm most obsessed aboutespecial essens in automotive. Very often it's partner channel and there'sthis really really good partner, podcast called the ultimate guy topartner in but by Vince Mansion he's a Microsoft that partner executive. Ihighly highly recommend everybody to listen to that podcast. Maybe one he'llbe in his podcast will see, but I will tell him: Hey you got you got to makesure so the an all of these will be in the show notes, folks to books and thispodcast to okay. We have two more. Is there Idon't again because you're so busy? This is always a loaded question, butis there a movie or something that when you come across it on TV, the few hoursyou can watch TV? Is there something that you always stop and watch andleaving list a little bit of it? I don't like any fiction because I liketo live in a reality, so I don't like leg fiction and I love happy thoughtsand happy moments, and them I don't k watch reality shows, I think, is justMakita brain over lous. So the only things that I watch is anything that'sromance and comedy. Okay. I can you thing: Okay show any of any of thoseokay, so we need. We need to happy endings yeah. No, I'm not a big reality.TV show either. Okay, so two more okay, I'm going to bring your closestcircle of friends, maybe your twin, maybe your pardon or afew other people, your best friend, who tells you you ask why too many times,and if I said to them to describe you...

...in one word, what would it be good question? The probably some very high mainac have extreme high expectations ofeverything. I do, whether it's my business, whether it's my friends,whether it's my relationships so yeah, though the probably say my expectations,are really really high. Okay, I like that. Okay, so we've talked about a lot of thingstoday and I could sit here and continue to keep chatting and I hope you'll comeback again in the future, but if there was one thing out of allwe've what we've talked about today, if there's one thing, you hope that thelisteners would take away and you're saying this is the one thing I hope youget today. What would it be? Customer experience is a competitiveadvantage. I love that so again. Thank you so much this has beenmagnificent. I think it's been so much fun chatting with you so tell peoplehow they can connect with you if you're out on social media. Where is the placethat they can connect with you, as well, as will link your website for yourcompany in here too, but if they want to talk with you chat with you connectwith you. Where do they find you yeah? I am all over Social Media Instagramfacebook length an. I M The only line an savvy in the world, so it's veryeasy to find me right and I would recommend folks listen the one greatthing: I've been very blessed with having guests all every single one ofmy guess has been very open to connecting. So, if you want to connect,please connect, ask questions, be as inquisitive as a Liman is to always askwhy people are here to help you, and that was, as they said. The reason whywe built this podcast was to help you with those questions, especially newleaders. Getting into this position so as we wind up again, as I say at theend of every episode, thank you so much don't forget to subscribe wherever youlisten to podcast subscribe to this, we put out new episodes every Mondays andThursdays also, if you want to watch jump over to the YouTube channel aswell subscribe there. Please leave your comments. Please share it out, there'sa lot of people who could use the information that lime and share todaywith you, and I appreciate that. As always. I appreciate your time. I knowthere's a lot of places. You could spend some time to get information andthe fact that you spend it here means a lot to me and, as I say, the end ofevery episode you're in charge, but now lyman gave you a few more tools to helpyou become more successful, both professionally and personally. Thankyou again and I look forward to seeing you on the next episode Wyman again.Thank you. So much hope to see you and thanks glad. Thank you. Smuch having me.

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